jjcole said:

The rulebook seems to specify that refreshing cards happens after things that specifically say "at the start of your turn", even though they're in the same phase.

Simultaneous action gets really tricky.  If you've got one card that says "if you have more than 2 wounds, remove all but 2 of them" and another card that says "remove 1 wound", telling players that they happen "all at once" doesn't really clarify anything.  If a card says "exhaust at the start of your turn", players are going to ask whether that happens before or after you refresh cards, and "at the same time" is not a valid answer.

In 1e, the player could choose the order of start-of-turn effects.

So still no consensus on my original question huh?

All we really need to know is:

1) Can a hero buff the defense of a character who is attacking himself via Dark Charm?

2) Can the Overlord play monster-buffing cards on a hero that is attacking or moving through the use of Dark Charm?

I wish they wouldn't have used the phrase, "As if he were a monster" because that's the height of ambiguity.

Also, some people were concerned that Dark Charm can't force a character to attack himself. The card specifically says it can.

Most of us don't have the game.  It's hard to answer questions about specific cards without actually seeing the entire text of those cards.

MasterBeastman said:

I would ask FFG for a definitive answer to both of those, but personally, I would say yes to both, for these reasons:

1. He's still a character/hero, so why not?

2. He's attacking AS IF he were a monster.  So anything that modifies an attack of a monster (i.e. a plus to damage or the like) seems a natural fit.  Of course, the character ISN'T a monster, so cards that say 'sacrifice a monster' couldn't target him.

Just my thoughts anyway.

Antistone said:

Suppose you could do that, you still only get to refresh it once a turn, so it would mean you hadn't used it in the previous turn.

This question came up during the preview weekend at our local store, and we ruled that the "as if it were a monster" part of Dark Charm applies only to the declaration of the attack (necessary to make it legal to attack another hero), and for all other intents and purposes both figures (attacker and defender) are still heroes and not monsters.

Columbob said:

Yes.  This wouldn't let you use it more often overall, just let you "save" an unused one for the start of your next turn.  Still, that might be pretty useful.