Gizlivadi said:

I don't know, that seems a bit narrowminded to me. "The Ring" means something specific in the Lord of the Rings without meaning that no other rings can exist - in fact we know others do. However if in conversation Gandalf said "the ring" - it would mean something to everyone round the table. 

Similarly, although the setting contains different Palantirs only one of them is actually avaliable to the free people - who could very easily call it the Palantir. 

If they had access to the others they would be "the Palantir of…" and the first one would probably continue to be called the Palantir.

From our point of view as outsiders we know that other Palantir's exist, but if they were trying to name it for the theme within the world, I don't see what's wrong with it being called that.

You're essentially trying to apply logic to langauge - but we use language in a fluid way.

Rapier said:

That was the One Ring. Pretty much the only ring that mattered without having to say its name. In this case, there are seven Palantiri, only seven, and as far as I know none is more important than the others to be called just "The Palantir" (even if one was, it would be the Orthanc one). 

Also, what's that about "only one of them is available to the free peoples"? There were several Palantiri that were available to the free peoples in different places, and some of them were lost or their users corrupted, so it's not really "The" Palantir as you suggest. 

The worst of all is that the card is not called "The Palantir" but rather just "Palantir" which feels rather generic and does not suggest a limited number of them, of which there was, and a very small one.

I'm not trying to adapt logic to "just language". I'm trying to apply logic in a rather finite element-naming system. If it was just language and the way people "name it within their world", we could as well have "Halfling" or "Little one" instead of "Merry" and "Pippin", since Boromir and many other characters used to call them that in the novel.

My first thought for the ranger was Halbarad, he is, after all, an "Heir of Numenor" in a sense.  I am hoping we will get a Faramir hero sometime during this cycle and feel it's almost a lock.  And if it is Faramir, I don't mind having to wait for 3-4 more adventure packs (cry me a river, whiners! jk)

Yeah, after seeing that palantir I'm hoping we'll get things like: Palantir of Osgiliath, …of Orthanc, Amon Sul, etc.  I know that in the book the only one's they really used were the Orthanc Stone and one at Minas Tirith, but the game is about possibilities (you can, after all, have a group of heroes with Thorin Oakenshield, Eowyn, and Glorfindel, which doesn't really make perfect sense, lorewise) so why not make a card for the Palantir of Annuminas?  One was kept there in Elendil's day.

That generic palantir is underwhelming to me, especially seeing as it can hit you for 6 threat.  Doesn't mean I won't try using it, and I've been way wrong about judging card's value before.

I'd be much more worked up about the playability of the card rather than its specific name but since this is such a lore based game I suppose I see the point.

Another side note on the inevitable Faramir hero…PLEASE let his art be better than his previous iteration.  The leadership ally version didn't look awful; but with the talent of most of the artists illustrating this game, I think they can do far better.  I also agree that he'll be a lock for the spirit sphere with a low starting threat. Kind of hope his stats are better than the ally, or if they're the same let him have an awesome ability. I trust the designers tho

Well, yeah, regarding its playability, it's pretty terrible… Exhausting Palantir and the Noble hero to draw up to 3 cards? and that's only if the three cards were the same type, which is highly unlikely in most scenarios, and if not, raise your threat by 2? Terrible, considering we can draw 2 cards securely with Beravor.

Rapier said:

But there were more than 1 Palantir available for Free People of Middle Earth.

Amon Sul Stone and Annuminas Stone are underneath the ocean (2/7 unavailable)
Osgiliath Stone is at the bottom of River Anduin (3/7 unavaialble)
Orthanc Stone is under control of Saruman, who is traiter for both sides (4/7 unavailalbe)
Ithil Stone has been sieged and corrupted by Sauron for himself (5/7 unavailable)

But Elostirion Stone and Arnor (Minas Tirith) Stone were available.

Sure Elostirion Stone can only look to the ocean westward and cannot be used for any other task, but 3 Elven Rings were supposed to be secrete yet we have Vilya as available card.

By naming Arnor Stone 'Palantir', it would be really awkward for them to add Elostirion Stone during Shire or Elven expansion.

Also many people who studied Lore knew about 7 Palantir. Wizards certain knew about them, Stewards of Gondor knew about them, surely noble families of Noldor would know about it, Elves of Grey Harbour would know about it, and many other loremasters who studied Numenor would know as well. (The White Tree and 7 Seeing Stones are the most famous Numenorean heirloom after all)

If I remember right, the term 'Ithil Stone' was used by one of the characters in the book (can't remember if it was actual LotR book or one of appendix), so Palantirs were certainly named within Middle Earth to distinguish one from another.

But I guess if we are to never see Elostirion Stone within the game, calling Arnor Stone 'Palantir' wouldn't be problem at all.

Sorry for going off on the tangent, but I think the power of Palantir is being grossly underestimated.  I can't wait for it! 

You're not talking about a card that can draw 0-3 cards with a possible threat of 0-6.  You're talking about a 1 cost neutral card that can draw 0-3 cards the first time you use it AND show you how to play the next 1-3 turns.  If you are playing solo you just found out what you are up against for up to the next 3! Turns.  Let that sink in.  Yes, if there are engaged enemies or surges, the cards will play faster.  And if that is the case, you now know shadow effects coming into play.  I can't be the only one that goes from …the attack will bounce to I just lost a hero(and maybe the game) because of a brutal shadow effect.

Further, on the second turn, you now know up to 2 of the encounter cards so your ability to call the cards and get the draw are much better.  All this for 1 cost up front.  If my threat is too high or I need the hero, I don't use it that turn.  No biggie, it cost 1 and it's not even restricted.

This is just stand alone.  I'm not getting into combos where you can see what the upcoming cards are to enhance it.  Of course you better be ready to deal with threat, but I'll deal with that happily.  I know there are other cards and deck types that give you these but not with one neutral card at 1 resource.  If you play solo One Deck to play all scenarios (and some heroes that happen to be nobles), you love this card.

Woz said:

I agree with this. The fact that it shows you the next 3 cards coming from the encounter deck is pretty huge, if it didn't have such a high threat risk I think it would be an auto-include. We have a couple of dwarfs that can lower threat that would probably use this a lot. Combined with Denethor you can also get rid of the cards you know are worth getting rid of (Even get rid of a card and know what it's replacement is). So I think its amazing in a spirt/lore deck. (that knowledge also lets you maximise things like ranger spikes, know when to save for strider's paths and so on).

Off Topic: I'd forgotton about the Palantir that looks to the west - but I don't functionally see how that could be a card. Functionally I think "The Palantir" would best reflect the relatitive importance of this Palantir compared to all the others, as far as the free people were concerned. I guess not having the word "The" to go with it is a little lazy, but not really a major issue to me. The fact that it's a unique artifiact more than accurately represents it's rairity.

When I first saw the Palantir, I was underwhelmed, but I'm starting to warm up to it. I view the card draw as a bonus, with the real attraction being the ability to see what's coming up in the encounter deck (which makes thematic sense as well). The potential threat gain is substantial, but they had to build a meaningful drawback into this thing, otherwise it would be too powerful. I have a feeling that we might see a hero in the next few AP's that synergizes well with the Palantir as well.

Gizlivadi said:

Yes, Beravor has a better draw-ability built in.  However, we can't all use her every game, particularly if we're playing a co-op game. 

Of course there is a couple drawbacks to using the card (threat generation and exhaust hero).  But the argument that it's restrictive because it has to be a Noble hero is a bit misleading as a high percentage of the heroes are Noble (75% of the core set, for example).  You still have to deal with exhausting a hero, but since Unexpected Courage makes it into EVERY deck that it possibly can, this is a pretty easy fix.  And since some heroes have a fix built right into them, it's even easier (depending on your deck).  Boromir (core) leaps into mind as an obvious candidate.  Granted using his readying ability and the Palantir will create the need for some serious threat control/reduction.  But pair him with a Spirit hero and the threat reduction events and it's definitely doable.  Imrahil is also a strong possibility.  Pairing it with Denethor and UC GUARANTEES that you can get positive results with it every turn.  Or simply putting it in a deck with Henemarth Riversong gets you the same result.  And as stated by someone else above, the ability to know definitively what the next three encounter cards are going to be is HUGE, even if it does carry a penalty with it.

So, yes, there is a price for using this card.  but I think it's a VERY well-balanced card, and that is SHOULD have that dangerous element to it (just as using the Palantir in the books was).  Not too powerful so that anyone is going to cry "broken", but with big enough potential value to make it worth it.  And it's also going to require some thought and strategy to get the best use of this card, definitely not an "easy" play that you can just throw into a deck and use without some severe repurcussions if used poorly.

Oddly, for as much grief (or support) as Glaurung gets from people on this board, this card made me think of him… lol.  He's always harping about how this game needs to be harder or more difficult to strategize.  While I don't think this card makes the game harder, per se, it definitely will require better plans of strategy than just plunking all the easy to use "power" cards into a deck!

benhanses said:

Yes you right, i complain a lot about it……. but as i see in HON cycle they dont make any crazy powerful player cards as before. Most of the players cards from Third cycle is ok. Not weak not strong. Actually im happy with HON and Third cycle. Looks like in my opinion we reach a good level in the game.

But Palantir for now in my opinion is quite useless……. Will see as Beorn (from Hall of Beorn)  say : maybe with some new players cards Palantir will be more interesting.

Also i think we will get very powerful player cards in Hobbit second box!!! So will see!

It's certainly an interesting card and I will give it a try once they publish this scenario in Germany. I guess Palantir makes the most sense when you choose "enemies" as type. That way you get two cards for each potential enemy, cards which might help you to deal with them. And if there are no enemies you have to raise your threat, ok, but you can safely send everyone questing during the next three turns. And Rumours from the Earth can help you to lower your threat a bit if you called the wrong type. With Shadow of the Past you can even place a correct card type at the top. For me Palantir is a serious alternative to Risk some Light.